The Second Debate - What's The Verdict?

What are your thoughts about the Town Hall Debate?

It didn't look like McCain did what he needed to do - Hit a Grand Slam Home Run.

Obama appeared just as comfortable with this format as he does with the more structured debate format. On the other hand, the Town Hall format was supposed to be an advantage for McCain.

This time around Obama did a better job of not allowing McCain to get away with misstatements. But I wish he would have mentioned that McCain (in the recent past) has called for cuts to Medicare and for putting Americans' Social Security on Wall Street.
That would have crushed McCain, IMO. But once again, Obama allowed McCain to go unpunished on his past statements. Obama also failed to point out that McCain's BS $5,000.00 coupon for healthcare would not be enough to cover the medical costs for Americans.


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UPDATE

Instapoll results from CNN

Who did the best job in the debate?
McCain (R) 30
Obama (D) 54

Opinion of Barack Obama (before debate)
Favorable: 64 (60)
Unfavorable: 34 (38)

Opinion of John McCain (before debate)
Favorable: 51 (51)
Unfavorable: 46 (46)

Note: Notice no change in the favorable/unfavorable for McCain. This is not good news for Mr. Straightalk. He had to move his favorable numbers up quite a bit tonight.

This is Devastating info for McCain!!! But it just means that they will probably continue to go negative on Obama, because that's all that McCain/Palin have going for them right now.

From CBS

Who won?
McCain (R) 27
Obama (D) 39
Draw 35

Will Obama will make the right decisions on the economy?
Before debate: 54
After debate: 68

Will McCain will make the right decisions on the economy?
Before debate: 41
After debate: 49


Obama did better than I thought (yes, i'm always hard on Obama, because we have to jump higher, run faster, and work harder just to be on equal ground).

My favorite quote from Obama tonight was when he responded to McCain (I forgot on what question) saying that a wheel had fallen off of the Straight Talk Express. lol.
That may have been the quote of the night.

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UDPATE 2

More from CNN snap poll

Who expressed his views more clearly in the debate?

Obama 60
McCain 30

Who spent more time attacking his opponent?

Obama 17
McCain 63

Who seemed to be the stronger leader?

Obama 54
McCain 43

Who was most likeable?

Obama 65
McCain 28

Black Political Analysis's Thoughts on the Debate

At Ole Miss, we were kept busy Debate Week. Lots of interviews with print, radio and television journalists. Good fun. Yet, at the end of the night, I watched it on television (albeit in the media tent next to the Ford Center) like most Americans.

I felt that Senator Obama was stronger on the economic points early in the debate. He did a better job of talking to the middle class and explaining why his policies would benefit the middle class. He was very good at explaining how the Republican philosophy is an illusion: cut taxes, cut regulation = a growing gap between rich and poor and a shrinking middle class.

I did not like how often Obama said "I agree with you, John" during the debate. To me, it seemed a little demeaning and I did not think he needed to go there. Obama is more likely to work to find a consensus on contentious policy matters and polling seems to bear this view out. Many independents seem to find Obama more agreeable, so he might end up benefiting by appearing more concerned with opposing viewpoints. It certainly makes him seem less partisan, and McCain more partisan.

Senator McCain can barely hide his disdain for Obama. His disrespect for Obama (his peer) is palpable. It feeds into the notion that McCain is too dismissive of competing viewpoints. While Obama handled his own on foreign policy, McCain used his experience to his advantage. Many Americans were sure to be impressed by the litany of places McCain has visited and many world leaders he has met.

Is that actually trivial? It shouldn't be, but it is. In 2000, George Bush practically bragged about how few places he'd visited. Yet, Americans were quite comfortable electing a provincial nativist in '00,;now it seems McCain can challenge Obama because he's only been to Iraq twice.

Finally, McCain was more aggressive and punchy as the debate wore on. Obama was reduced to parrying McCain's jabs, but could not really go on the offensive, which I thought would suit his needs better. I call it a draw.

Why He Makes Me Wanna Holler and Throw Up Both of My Hands

I listened to tonights debate while at work...and I have to say, I am mad as Hell. I'm beside myself. I had to reach for my Excedrin (thank Goodness for this wonder drug) before I even got home, to soothe my Migraine.

I couldn't believe what I heard tonight. After what happened in Mississippi finally sunk in, my anger turned towards Obama's staff... Who in the Hell is advising this man? It is clear to me that it may be time for David Axelrod and David Plouffe to step aside. Can't we get James Carville or someone else with a little backbone to take a leading role in the Obama campaign? Completely removing and replacing Axelrod and Plouffe may not be the best answer, but they could at least bring someone else in to take over strategy, while Axelrod remains as a figurehead. The team that is coaching Obama for these debates could definitely be shown the door...or could at least be shaken up somewhat. What I have seen thus far just doesn't cut it for me. The Nice Guy (i'm scared to grow a pair) routine must end.

Obama did o.k. tonight... but o.k. isn't enough when you are going against the traditionally ideal default President from the incumbent Party.... in a Nation so reluctant to change. Obama did o.k. when he had a golden opportunity to hit a Home Run (Hell.. a few Home Runs for that matter). It's like Barry Bonds taking pitches from an elder League pitcher in the game of his life... but passing up the opportunity to knock one out of the ballpark. Instead, he settles for a base hit.

What do I mean by default President? Well, American voters have been conditioned to be more open to White men for the Presidency. It is assumed that a White man will be better for the Country... and it is an intrinsic assumption, built into the American cultural fabric over the years. White candidates have an advantage with the American people just by default... especially when the opponent happens to be Black. And as in most competition, (let's use Boxing as an example), you have to knock off the champion in convincing fashion if you want to take the title. A draw just won't do. Obama and his staff should understand that he will always have the burden of proof. This is an ugly fact of American politics. All McCain has to do in these debates, as the default character, is show up...not pass out, and sound halfway competent. That's his only burden. Obama, on the other hand, must sell himself to the American people at all times....even if the polls appear to be in his favor, and even when it appears that he's on the right side on the issues, and on the right side of history. Obama has to explain to voters why they shouldn't pick the comfortable default candidate, and why they should choose him instead. That's always a tougher hill to climb.


What Obama needed to do tonight, ...and what his primary focus should have been, was to use his talent as a Harvard trained lawyer to clearly and methodically connect the dots for the American people between John McCain and the financial crisis on Wall Street (and Main Street). Obama should have done this straight out of the gate tonight...and nailed it down within the first 10 minutes. The whole World was Obama's courtroom, with McCain as the defendant. But Obama dropped the ball. He didn't even make the effort. This was Obama's big chance to corner McCain.... he had him right where he wanted him, but he let him go once again. The open debate format was yet another gift for Obama, but he didn't take advantage of the opportunity. Obama has done this several times before, but this takes the cake. There was nothing about McCain's history of pushing for deregulation of Wall Street, which helped lead to this disaster... nothing about one of McCain's top economic advisors, Rick Davis, being a big money lobbyist for Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac at the same time that he was advising McCain.... nothing about McCain's attempt to hijack events surrounding the crisis for political gain... a gamble that turned into a failure for McCain (since his presence in Washington D.C. and his attempts to politicize the crisis only made matters worse, not better...and because he had to backtrack at the last moment and attend the debate after all...after Obama called his bluff)... This was Obama's chance to crush McCain.

In the second half of the debate- on the topic of foreign policy - McCain actually held his own, and may have even beat Obama. All in all... this debate, from my independent perspective, appeared to be a draw. Neither candidate will likely be harmed too badly or benefit much at all from the events tonight. However, this was a debate that Obama could have, and should have won convincingly. McCain may actually see a slight bounce from this debate... I wouldn't be surprised to see the polls tighten again in McCain's favor in the next few days...but it probably won't last long. Everything, at the moment, seems to be overshadowed by the events taking place in the economy.

Some post-debate polling shows that Obama did well among independents. But it's hard to know if these particular independents were planning to vote for Obama anyway. I think Obama has good will points that he has earned over the last 2 years, and the current economic situation to thank for his good poll numbers after this debate. Those good poll numbers are not likely due to his performance in Oxford Mississippi.

How in the World could Obama's staff, and his debate prep. team in particular, not allow their candidate to paint the right picture of John McCain? It is beyond comprehension. Not only did they fail on that front, but they allowed McCain to bounce off of the ropes several times to take some great shots at Obama. McCain was allowed to reframe the debate, and turn attention away from himself...and back onto Obama... when it should have been all about McCain and his complicity in the current financial mess. Some Americans watching the debate and not really knowing the issues or the candidates all that well, could have easily walked away with the idea that McCain is some sort of anti-corruption, anti-lobbying watchdog who is looking out for the best interests of tax payers. Nothing could be further from the truth.

How in the world could Obama allow himself to be matched (tied) or beaten back by a senile, 72 year old man who out of touch with the realities faced by working Americans?

Luckily Obama has two more chances to go after McCain... and that walking disaster named Sarah Palin could also help Obama next week. I have my fingers crossed that Biden won't ----- up.

Again... all McCain and Palin have to do in order to look good at these events is to just show up. They get a B+ or A- just for that. Biden has to beat this woman without being perceived as overbearing. He has to do his thing with a smile on his face.

Is it November 4th yet?

Carry on....

The Texas Democratic Debate - The Verdict

Update: So, Who Won The Debate? Check The Results of the Daily Kos Poll.

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My original Post-debate comments

As expected... the corporate media did its best to help Hillary Clinton tonight, but there was no doubt who came away looking better after this debate.

The bottom line is, Clinton needed a knockout victory in this debate to help halt Obama's momentum going into March 4th. But she came up short. In fact, she didn't even score a knockdown, let alone the knockout blow that she needed.

Obama, on the other hand, was polished tonight. He gave one of the best debate performances to date, and it came at a time when he really needed to look good, particularly for voters in Texas and Ohio. Going into the debate, Obama needed to hold his own. But he went above and beyond that tonight. Not only did he hold his ground, but he out maneuvered Clinton, and looked very Presidential in the process.
If by some miracle he wins Texas, his campaign staff will have to look back at this debate as a crucial moment.

Obama had a response for every attack and cheap shot that Clinton threw his way. She continued with the same tired "experience" argument... the same "day one" nonsense that has not worked for weeks. You would think her campaign handlers would have revamped her message by now. Obama was ready for everything she had...which, as it turns out, was nothing new.

Also, when asked about the delegate debacle, Hillary lied and claimed that she was "not worried about that"... that it was no big deal to her. Yet, at this very moment, her operatives are scheming, hoping to take the nomination by underhanded means (if they can). So it's obviously a big issue for her.

The best part?

When the crowd responded with Booos to Hillary Clinton's arrogant attack in which she claimed that Obama's theme of "Change You Can Believe In" really stood for "Change That You Can Xerox". That attack pertained to Obama's use of words that were previously used by Deval Patrick, the Governor of Massachusetts and a friend of Obama's....as well as being the Co-Chair of Obama's National Campaign. It was Patrick who suggested that Obama use the line.

The media attempted to help Clinton by grossly overplaying what was probably her only strong moment in the debate - when she offered conciliatory comments in the last 20 seconds of the program. Sheila Jackson Lee (yet another CBC Clinton supporter) and the boneheaded pundits from MSNBC and CNN claimed that this was a "glorious moment" for Clinton and suggested that this was where she won the debate. They claimed that the comments drew a standing ovation. WRONG! The standing ovation came because it was the end of the debate. STOP THE LYING AND HYPERBOLE! This is not journalism or first rate reporting. It's infotainment run amuck. All of the spin is enough to give you motion sickness.

Below is a live blog roundup of the debate, taken from the BaltimoreSun.com (Read from the bottom up)

LIVE BLOG: THE DEMOCRATIC DEBATE IN AUSTIN

By Lisa Anderson

GOOD EVENING!

The stakes couldn't be higher in Austin, Texas tonight as Sens. Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama go one-on-one in a Democratic presidential debate sponsored by CNN and airing at 7 PM (CST).

I am blogging for you from my post in New York City, while my colleagues in Austin cover the action on the ground in the Longhorn State.

The crucial, delegate-rich Texas and Ohio primaries are coming up on March 4 and new Washington Post-ABC News polls show the two candidates locked in a Texas tie, while Clinton of New York shows a narrow lead in Ohio over her Senate colleague from Illinois.

Tonight's debate represents their first face-off since their meeting in Hollywood on Jan. 31. They will have only one more planned televised debate--February 26 on MSNBC--before what are shaping up as very close contests in Texas and Ohio.

Clinton, who has lost the last 10 state primaries and caucuses to Obama, desperately needs to win, and win big. To do that, she must use this debate to convince voters that she truly is not only tough enough and experienced enough for the nation's top job, but diplomatic enough to overcome the polarizing image that dogs her.

Obama, who has been on an impressive roll, wants to keep that roll going through the next big contests and beyond. To do that, he must effectively counter Clinton's charges that "the best words in the world aren't enough unless you match them with action." Or, in Texas parlance, that he's all hat and no cattle. And, he must avoid getting lost in the verbal weeds when talking about policy.

Given what has transpired in the last three weeks, it will be interesting to see if the sarsaparilla sweetness that drenched the last encounter between these two will continue or if they are now locked and loaded for a showdown tonight.

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9:55 pm--LET'S AGREE THAT WE REALLY DO AGREE

While they may have been trying to draw more sharply the differences between them, Clinton and Obama Thursday night succeeded more in showcasing the similarities in their positions.

As hard as they tried to elbow each other, more often than not they ended up saying that they "agreed" with each other.

Given the fact that polls show them deadlocked in Texas and extremely close in Ohio--the next two big primaries on March 4--there seemed to be little in this debate that promised to significantly shift those numbers.

Neither candidate stumbled and both got off some good lines. Some of Clinton's best lines, in fact, were her last and, indeed, she got the very last word in the debate.

Before Texans and Ohioans vote, Obama and Clinton will have one more televised go at each other during the MSNBC debate next Tuesday.

Thank you for joining me tonight.

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9:45pm--ONE MORE QUESTION.......

What was the moment that tested you the most, the candidates are asked.

Obama notes he was raised by a single mom, made mistakes in his youth but learned to "take responsibility" not only for his own actions but how to help others. His cumulative experience as a community organizer and attorney,he said, is what helps him to lead and bring people togetrher.

Said Clinton, wryly, "Well I think everybody here knows" I've had some challenges in my life." The audience laughs. But, she said, nothing she has been through is as tough as some of the things she's seen, including badly wounded soldiers coming home from Iraq.."The hits I've taken in life are nothing compared to what goes on everyday" in the lives of people around the country.

No matter what happens, she said of herself and Obama, "We're going to be fine. We have strong support from our families and firends. I just hope we'll be able to say the same thing about the American people and that's what this election should be about."

Obama appeared to open his mouth to add something, but Campbell Brown abruptly ended the debate .

To his credit, Obama nonethless, graciously held Clinton's chair as she rose to leave. She smiled. After all, she had the last word.

And that was that.

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9: 36pm--MUM'S THE WORD

The subject is secrecy. Obama is asked by CNN's John King why he has not disclosed what earmarks he has proposed in the budget. Not true, Obama said. He brushed the question away with a promise that he'd get the info for King asap. "I've been consistently in favor of more disclosure about earmarks," he said, making sure they are "not done in the dark of night" and will push for that when he's president.

Clinton says she's going to get us back to "fiscal responsibility," and did we mention middle-class tax cuts, college affordability and universal healthcare? On those counts, she said, she's more than a match for anything McCain can throw at her.

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9:30pm--IS THE SURGE WORKING?

Surge or no surge, Clinton will begin withdrawing troops within 60 days of her inauguration and make the Iraqis get serious about carrying their own water.

Obama admits that violence has been reduced in Iraq since the surge began surging. "But, this is a tactical victory imposed upon a huge strategic blunder," he said. Moreover, he said, it will be easier for the candidate opposed to Iraq from the beginning to debate and draw a contrast with John McCain. The Arizona senator and presumptive GOP presidential nominee, Obama said, has indicated the U.S. may have troops in Iraq for 100 years.

Time for another commercial break.....

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9:22 pm--WHO'S MORE READY TO LEAD?

Clinton quickly assures the questioner that she's the one who's ready on Day One-- then insists on getting back to her healthcare answer which was so rudely interrupted.

Obama points out that Massachusetts, which has a universal healthcare plan, has had to exempt 20 percent of the uninsured in the state because they simply could not pay for insurance, despite the threat of fines.

Clinton says programs like Social Security and Medicaid would never have worked had everyone not been obliged to contribute. The same thing for universal healthcare, she said. "I want universal healthcare," she added, verbally stamping her feet.

Campbell Brown struggles to get them back to the leadership question.

Clinton launches into another litany of her accomplishments, including serving on the Senate Armed Services Committee. "Just this week," she pointed out, we had elections in Pakistan..change of government in Cuba, independence in Kosovo and our embassy in Serbia set on fire. "When you think about everything that is going to happen...I believe I am prepared and ready on Day One to be the commander in chief, to be the president...And that is what I'm putting forth to the voters."

'I wouldn't be running if I didn't think I was prepared to be commander in chief," Obama countered. He stresses that he will use the military wisely and harks back to Clinton's vote to authorize the war in Iraq.

By opposing the war, he said, "I believe I showed the judgment to be commander in chief and Sen. Clinton was wrong in her judgment." In fact, he basically said, he has shown the best judgment in almost everything. So there--again.

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9:09 pm--HEALTHCARE REDUX

Obama stresses that he and Clinton agree that everybody needs healthcare, they just want to get there in different ways. He says he knows that everyone wants healthcare, but not everyone can afford it and that's why he thinks mandatory insurance is not the way to go.

Clinton opens her mouth, raises her hand and clearly is dying to respond--but Campbell Brown cuts her off to go to commericial....If Clinton's smile gets any tighter she'll need the Jaws of Life.

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9:01 pm--"COPYCAT?"

Asked about the charge that he plagarized a speech from Massachusetts Gov. Deval Patrick, Obama scoffed. "The notion that I stole the line from someone who is my national co-chair, who gave me the line, is silly," he said, saying the "silly season" has set in.

Clinton swooped in like a raptor . "If your candidacy is going to be about words, they should be your own words," she snapped Then, she came in for the kill, "Lifting passages from someone else's speeches isn't change you can believe in, it's Xeroxing," she said, to a chorus of boos.

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8:50 --THEY'RE BAAAACK...

John King asks them about the difference between their jabs at each other on the stump and c the cordiality on display so far tonight,
He asks Clinton if she things Obama is all hat and no cattle. She says she thinks the next president will have to be less hat and more cattle, without commenting directly on Obama's haberdashery or livestock.
However, she stresses "there are differences between our records and our experiences." She notes nastily that one of Obama's surrogates was tongue-tied recently when asked to name one of his accomplishments.

"I think actions do speak louder than words," Obama shot back and began listing all the great things he accomplished in his political career so far, both in the Illinois legislature and in the U.S. Senate.

"I do think there is a fundamental difference between us in how change comes about," he said, noting he's been endorsed by every major newspaper in the state of Texas. He said his rival has implied that "somehow they've been duped" and have yet to see the reality of things.

You need more than policy positions to govern, he said pointedly You also need to inspire.

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8:48--ENGLISH FOR ALL?

Both Obama and Clinton agree--yes again--that everyone should learn to speak English in America, although bilingual education is an important aid in that effort.
Obama also wants English speaking children to learn other languages.

So far, a bit sharp elbowing at the top, but mostly they seem to agree on just about everything--except who should be president....

Commercial Break...

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8:43 pm--ON THE (BORDER) FENCE

Clinton said the U. of Texas at Brownsville would wind up with part of its campus cut off by the proposed border fence with Texas, calling some of these plans absurd. "There may be some places where a physical barrier is appropriate" but as with so much the "Bush administration has gone off the deep end," she said.
"There is technology than can be used instead of a physical barrier," Clinton said, noting that the views of the people who live along the border should be heard.

Obama said, "Well, this is an area where Sen. Clinton and I almost totally agree." Clinton nodded her head and smiled slightly.

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8:35 pm--IMMIGRATION

Asked if the canadidates would stop raids on illegal immigrants--a huge issue in Texas--Clinton emphasized a more humane approach that keeps parents from being ripped suddenly from their children and that would establish a path to citizenship.
Obama agreed and added that it is "absolutely critical" that we tone down the rhetoric in the immigration debate that leads to discrimination. He also wants to institute comprehensive reform that cracks down on employers who hire undocumented workers but doesn't make the path to legal citizenship so expensive and difficult that people are discouraged from trying.

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8:25 pm--ECONOMICS 101--AGAIN

Obama said he and Clinton agree on many economic issues, the question is "how to get it done?"

A priority must be to overcome the influence of special interests, he said, noting that's an area where he thought he and Clinton slightly diverge.
Clinton also agreed that they agree on a number of things, including adjusting the tax code to help the middle class. Clinton launched into a litany of all the other things she would do, such as creating new "green jobs," put people to work rebuilding the infrastructure and "end George Bush's war on science."
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8:15 pm--LIFE POST-FIDEL

Clinton says she's ready to work with a new Cuban government and "make it very clear if Cuba moves toward democracy and freedom for its people" the U.S. will work with them.

Obama said he's ready to meet with the next leader of Cuba--with preparation and an agenda--saying the US should talk not just with its friends. This is where he got into trouble on another occasion, when Hillary jumped him, insinuating he was naive for saying he would talk to any leader without condition.
This time he seemed to side-step that, but Clinton wouldn't let him off the hook that easily. "There has been this difference between us about when the president should offer a meeting, without conditions....," she said, stressing that while the unilateral arrogance of the Bush administration is over, prudence is also in order.
Obama reiterated that "preparation is important," but said the president must take a more active role in diplomacy than in the past.
So there.

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8:03 pm--AND THEY'RE OFF

Obama won the coin toss and opted to go second with his opening statement, so Clinton has begun with a chat about her happy memories of the Longhorn State, about how Rep. Barbara Jordan and Gov. Ann Richards were such inspirations to her. Then she launched into how she has pioneered health care for children and families and will continue to do that in the White House. She heartily invited the people of Texas and Ohio to help her "continue to make a difference" for Americans.

Obama, in his turn, assured the audience that he and Clinton were friends before this campaign and will be friends when it's over. Then he talked about how he has encountered families whose mortgages have doubled, people who work two jobs and can't afford health care, communities devastated by jobs shipped overseas. And families whose loved ones have been lost in "a war I believe never should have been authorized." Zing into Clinton, who smiled tightly but looked taken aback.
"Washington is a place where good ideas go to die," Obama said, because "too many politicians are interested in scoring political points rather than" resolving differences to get things done.

So, the gloves are off from the get-go tonight.